Old man Phil

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

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Jim Plunkett was thought of as a loser after 7 seasons of futility while QB-ing bad teams on the New England Patriots and the San Francisco 49ers from 1971 through 1977. After being out of football for 2 seasons, he came back with the Raiders and resurrected his career behind one of the best offensive lines in the history of professional football. He won a Super Bowl in 1980, won another Super Bowl in 1983, and led the Raiders to an 8-1 record in 1982 before they were upset by the Jets in the 2nd round of the playoffs.

Plunkett's record as a starter with the Patriots and the 49ers between 1971 and 1977 was 34-53.

Plunkett's record as a starter with the Raiders between 1980 and 1984 was 34-12.


The Colts were 8-2 this season before Daniel Jones hurt his leg, and he was ranked #4 in the NFL in passer rating at that point. They lost the last 2 games that he played entirely by a very close margin while his mobility, which is a big part of his game for exponential reasons, was severely hampered. Presuming that Jones is necessarily now average based largely on his 6 seasons playing with bad New York Giants teams and 1 season playing with the Colts is as faulty as saying that Jim Plunket had a career year in 1980, and therefore could not continue at that success rate, which he clearly dd.

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And I'm not asserting that Daniel Jones will necessarily continue the success that he had this season with the Colts, like Plunkett did with the Raiders ...... he might continue to thrive, or he might fall flat on his face ...... but we won't know that for at least a couple of more years.

o

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

o


And I'm not asserting that Daniel Jones will necessarily continue the success that he had this season with the Colts, like Plunkett did with the Raiders ...... he might continue to thrive, or he might fall flat on his face ...... but we won't know that for at least a couple of more years.

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A more recent example of a QB resurrecting his career with better teams after languishing in mediocrity with mostly mediocre teams is Rich Gannon. Gannon was drafted in 1987, but did not get significant playing time until 1990 with the Vikings.


In 4 seasons as a starter between 1990 and 1993 Gannon had 43 TD's, 42 INT's, and a QB rating of 72.9.

In 7 seasons as a starter between 1996 and 2002 Gannon had 128 TD's, 55 INT's, and a QB rating of 90.7.


Gannon's record as a starting QB between 1990 and 1993 was 20-19.

Gannon's record as a starting QB between 1996 and 2002 was 52-31.


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A smaller sample size of a QB flailing badly early in his career and then turning it around with a much better team would be Steve Young.


In 2 seasons with the Buccaneers in 1985 and 1986, Steve Young had a record of 3-16 as a starting QB. He had 11 TD's 21 INT's, and a QB rating of 63.1

In his very first season with the 49ers in 1987 filling in for an injured Joe Montana, Young had 10 TD's, 0 INT's, and a QB rating of 120.8.

Young continued to thrive filling in for Montana when he was hurt over the next 3 seasons from 1988 through 1990, throwing for 13 TD's, 6 INT's, and a QB rating of 94.7.

Young became the 49'ers' full-time QB in 1991 when Montana was out with an injury, and the rest is history.



Would Steve Young have improved his game had he remained with the laughing-stock Buccaneers instead of being traded to the gold-mine 49ers ??? He may have, but it is highly unlikely that he would have put up numbers similar to what he did when he was playing for the 49ers ...... one can imagine how Archie Manning's career would have turned out had he been traded to the Raiders or the Steelers prior to the 1972 season.

o

[ChaosTheory]

My brain is telling me they brought him in to play, but for some reason I'm not 1000% ready to believe it unless Leonard just can't go.

I actually thought Leonard looked pretty good vs. JAX. What gets lost in the whole debacle is that we had some atrocious calls go against us, but nobody cared at that point. 16, 8, and 12-play scoring drives - Riley/Pittman got screwed out of a TD and screwed into a mind-melting INT (still can't believe that one).

I guess I won't be surprised by anything. Assuming Leonard can play: Rivers could backup Leonard as a true emergency, they could give him another week and let him take the reigns after SEA on short notice, or they could say fuck it and see what he can do against SEA.

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If anyone wants to join me, the cope-induced take I'm rolling with to make me feel better...

He mainly retired for priorities. Arm still looks ok from what players/reporters are saying. And consider that he was never really a rocket arm guy, anyway (especially by 2020). He was also, in his prime, one of the stiffest and most immobile QB's. Hopefully he can avoid gassing out.

So if the desire is there, his main weapon should still be intact, which is mental and pre-snap. ID the defense and get us in the right situation - let the playmakers loose.

A man can dream.

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory

My brain is telling me they brought him in to play, but for some reason I'm not 1000% ready to believe it unless Leonard just can't go.

I actually thought Leonard looked pretty good vs. JAX. What gets lost in the whole debacle is that we had some atrocious calls go against us, but nobody cared at that point. 16, 8, and 12-play scoring drives - Riley/Pittman got screwed out of a TD and screwed into a mind-melting INT (still can't believe that one.)

I guess I won't be surprised by anything. Assuming Leonard can play ...... Rivers could backup Leonard as a true emergency, they could give him another week and let him take the reigns after SEA on short notice, or they could say fuck it and see what he can do against SEA.

*****************

If anyone wants to join me, the cope-induced take I'm rolling with to make me feel better ......

He mainly retired for priorities. Arm still looks ok from what players/reporters are saying. And consider that he was never really a rocket arm guy, anyway (especially by 2020). He was also, in his prime, one of the stiffest and most immobile QB's. Hopefully he can avoid gassing out.

So if the desire is there, his main weapon should still be intact, which is mental and pre-snap. ID the defense and get us in the right situation ...... let the playmakers loose.

A man can dream.

o


I dreamed that Daniel Jones might have a Jim Plunkett-type of resurrection with the Colts, and for the most part he did, prior to breaking his fibula.

I'm also dreaming that Philip Rivers can still be an effective quarterback in the NFL ....... with the odds, of course, being much lower than the odds were for a Daniel Jones breakout season.

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[Oldcolt]

Hell yes Chaos. If the only joy you get from football is reality you're losing out on most of it. I will add that a ring would cap off Rivers career, ensure him the HOF and make him a folk hero to boot.

[Hoopsdoc]

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory

My brain is telling me they brought him in to play, but for some reason I'm not 1000% ready to believe it unless Leonard just can't go.

I actually thought Leonard looked pretty good vs. JAX. What gets lost in the whole debacle is that we had some atrocious calls go against us, but nobody cared at that point. 16, 8, and 12-play scoring drives - Riley/Pittman got screwed out of a TD and screwed into a mind-melting INT (still can't believe that one).

I guess I won't be surprised by anything. Assuming Leonard can play: Rivers could backup Leonard as a true emergency, they could give him another week and let him take the reigns after SEA on short notice, or they could say fuck it and see what he can do against SEA.

-------

If anyone wants to join me, the cope-induced take I'm rolling with to make me feel better...

He mainly retired for priorities. Arm still looks ok from what players/reporters are saying. And consider that he was never really a rocket arm guy, anyway (especially by 2020). He was also, in his prime, one of the stiffest and most immobile QB's. Hopefully he can avoid gassing out.

So if the desire is there, his main weapon should still be intact, which is mental and pre-snap. ID the defense and get us in the right situation - let the playmakers loose.

A man can dream.

I’m pretty sure Rivers will start.

[ChaosTheory]

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc

I’m pretty sure Rivers will start.

Could be. But between the short notice, the opponent vying for the #1 seed, this particular stadium environment, Braden Smith out, Buckner out, Gardner out, and the following two games being at home...

We'll see.

[albany ed]

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory

Could be. But between the short notice, the opponent vying for the #1 seed, this particular stadium environment, Braden Smith out, Buckner out, Gardner out, and the following two games being at home...

We'll see.

I'll watch, I'll pull for the team, pull for Rivers or Leonard to do well, but ...

I'll be shocked if this doesn't turn into a complete embarrassment for my team.

[Oldcolt]

Originally Posted by albany ed

I'll watch, I'll pull for the team, pull for Rivers or Leonard to do well, but ...

I'll be shocked if this doesn't turn into a complete embarrassment for my team.

Me to. But then again 7-1 shocked the crap out of me. I will not be embarrassed one bit no matter what happens. We really have no options at this point in the season. This is a Hail Mary but I see it as a football Hail Mary with a chance of hitting. I do love fighting all the way I sure hope the team can pull this improbable victory off. As long as we are hoping I'm also hoping AR bonds with River like he has with no other QB and learns from the man